Hello All

Having just enjoyed the bank holiday, it was slightly marred by more than one encounter along Myddleton Road by extremely drunk blokes in the middle of the day. Taking the kids to play table tennis was enlivened by a bloke clutching his lager whilst being sick on the pavement, whilst the riverbank descended into a scene from Hogarth by late afternoon.

Is it just me, or has street drinking, and drunkenness, been getting worse? A couple of weeks ago an ambulance had to come to outside the builders merchants to collect a woman who had drunk herself insensible by 11am. In the evenings coming home, there's often clusters of blokes drinking in doorways, especially if it's warm. I understand that lots of people live in flats and don't have outdoor space, but street drinking is really undermining Myddleton Road especially, and makes the river bank an intimidating place to go when it should be a community asset.

To elevate this above a personal moan, is there any appetite amongst fellow Bowes Parkers to make Myddleton Road (and the river bank) an alcohol free zone in the same way that they have round the Starting Gate pub in Ally Pally? This really consists of a few signs prohibiting problematic street boozing: it doesn't ban it outright, but ensures that it doesn't get out of hand. It wouldn't have any effect on bars and restaurants - it's aimed at the 8 cans on the doorstep crowd.

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The original process was to implement a Drinking Control Order. The legislation has changed and Marcus will find reference to Designated Public Place Orders. The powers given to local authorities in England and Wales to introduce Designated Public Place Orders (DPPOs) are contained in section 13 of the Criminal Justice and Police Act 2001 and section 26 of the Violent Crime Reduction Act 2006, subject to The Local Authorities (Alcohol Consumption in Designated Public Places) Regulations 2007. The relevant Home Office guidance and details of the process is attached to this reply.

Remember an Order must apply to a Public Place and it may be appropriate to consider the public highway and any New River land separately

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Marcus reports observing a number of drink related incidents on Myddleton Road....and this will surely detract from the Stop and Shop initiative.....

Premises selling alcohol should have been licensed by the local authority and are controlled by one or more designated premises supervisor (s) (DPS). 

Fixed Penalty notices can be issued by the police to persons who sell alcohol to under 18’s and those who buy for under 18s. 

Licensed Premises are required to maintain a Refusals book"

In order to demonstrate that Premises have well trained  staff they are required keep records of any training or instructions given. Employees are asked to date and sign training records to confirm that they have understood but may be encouraged into what is called "upselling"

The Local Authority may at any time apply for a review of personal and/or premises licences which may result in removal of a DPS, additional licence conditions, and/or a suspension of licence for up to 3 months. If considered appropriate, licences can be revoked. 

Within LBEnfield premises along the Hertford Road corridor have recently had licenses suspended or revoked because it is being alleged that alcohol has been sold without alcohol duty having been paid; {or, it is alleged that the alcohol has false labels}

To detail a complaint or to seek advice in respect of  Licensed premises within London Borough of Haringey contact 

licensing@haringey.gov.uk.

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I reported this to two labour counsellors 3 years ago and have reported it to the community police many times. There has been open drug dealing on the new river, I have been threatened once by two guys who were drunk on the bank of the river. No one wants to know.
I've stopped going to the walk on the river on a sunny day. I don't think it's safe.
We have a new labour MP is there a chance they will do anything?
It's out of control on Middleton road. I don't feel safe walking down there on my own in the evening.
Ive been told it's not so bad by some local people, so stopped mentioning it, and just stopped going. I'm pleased you have raised it.

It is a problem.

I too have become increasingly concerned about the clusters of people drinking in Myddleton Road, particularly on warm evenings.  I do believe that the dense, inadequate and often illegal housing behind Myddleton Road has led to this happening.  The banks of the New River have also suffered as a consequence of this.  I had someone pee in front of me.  He had a bag containing cans of lager.  I confronted him telling him to leave the river bank and take his bag of lagers with him.  He wasn't confrontational but all the same not a pleasant experience.  

As local councillors we take these concerns very seriously and have undertaken a number of actions to try and address the issues around crime and ASB and the perception of both. We have worked with ASBAT (the council’s ASB team), the local police team and with other departments within the council – planning, licensing, Veolia etc, to try and deal with some of the causes at source. We can assure residents that we flag up problem addresses and make sure that the police are aware of them too. We raise them at the Myddleton Road Strategy Group (MRSG) meetings and also at ward panel meetings, though the latter have not been held as regularly as we would like. I am sure that We Love Myddleton Road also discuss these concerns and members of that group do report back to the MRSG.

I met with the new local Police sergeant and we are due to meet with him again this week as we are conscious that despite what work might have been undertaken by the police alongside ASBAT, there is a genuine feeling that these issues are not being dealt with adequately. The problems around street drinking are particularly bad and we clearly need to deal with this before the summer. We will of course report back but we have always been of the view that the local police team needs to be more proactive in terms of saying what they have been doing. The ward panel meetings plus the MRSG and WLMR are just some of the ways in which they can communicate, but we have encouraged the use of Bowes and Bounds, obviously allowing for the fact that some information should remain confidential. We have also asked the Sergeant to reschedule the ward panel meeting as soon as possible and it is at these meetings that representatives from local groups can report and discuss concerns. Our view is that the ward panel meetings should be as representative as possible and we will be encouraging as broad a range of representatives as possible. We do ensure that Myddleton Road remains high on the list of priorities.

Our advice surgeries are advertised on the council website as our contact details.

Cllr Joanna Christophides

Thanks Joanna - it would be really good to hear any feedback from the new sergeant. It really is sad that the new river, what should be an absolute jewel of this area, does feel like a no go area at times. We walk our dog down there in the autumn and winter but wouldn't dream of it at this time of year.

Our perception of the street drinking is that it looks a lot worse than it actually is - they are loud, oafish and look threatening but by and large pose very little threat to other people. But it isn't the message that we want to portray - that Myddleton Road is a safe and welcoming street that is very much open for business. If it were at all possible to make Bowes Park an alcohol control area (like Grovelands Park) I think it would go a long way to solving the problem. However, I am sure that is easier for me to say than it is to be implemented in reality.

Hi Joanna. It would be interesting if you could post a brief recap of what happened in your meeting. If we could try to get something like the control zone that exists around the Starting Gate pub by Ally Pally train station I think it would be a good way to start to break the street drinking culture that seems to be developing. Additionally, some of the flats in Myddleton Road are used for "hard to house" tenants: obviously these people need somewhere to live, but the communities like ours that are expected to absorb them should be supported to ensure their tenancies don't cause problems. One way of doing this would be to make it clear, through the introduction of a no street drinking policy, that some behaviour is unacceptable.

It does seem an issue that is largely about Myddleton Road. Maybe if the police combined some of their frequent stops at Pizza Man or Vrisaki with a quick patrol up and down the road, with a quick look in at the river bank it would be a simple way to have a more visible presence.
Just came back with my two boys and we have the charming contingent of alcoholic louts at the junction of Marlborough Rd and Myddleton drinking and shouting. The open drug dealing has been going on for at least 15 years. A local pc told me they didn't have the time/resources whilst he and a group of fellow officers were tucking into their takeaway pizzas ...hmm!
Excuse my cynicism Councillor Joanna but until Haringey planning department start doing their jobs and looking at the illegal over saturated planning it will remain a huge problem.
Sorry should say "over saturated housing"

I'm forever pointing out that the outdoor gym is a non smoking non drinking area.

One day I'll come a cropper :O)

More smoking and drinking in there during the afternoon this week. My 3 year old loves to go in when we pass to see the bridge and it's usually a pleasant detour on whatever journey we're making... I really don't like exposing her (and my baby) to the boozing and cigarette smoke though. I don't find it threatening but do think it's unpleasant; dodging the cigarette smoke from the doorways on Myddleton Road is bad enough.

More than happy to come down and extinguish (very large water pistol) anyone's ciggerates if I'm in the area.

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